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IDProjectCategoryView StatusLast Update
0005580SUMoNew Featurepublic2019-07-20 10:59
Reporterjohnldove Assigned ToKyle_Katarn  
PrioritynormalSeverityminorReproducibilityhave not tried
Status acknowledgedResolutionopen 
PlatformLaptop PCOSWindowsOS Version10
Product Version5.9.4 
Target Version5.10.xFixed in Version 
Summary0005580: How to unregister SUMo?
DescriptionI could not find a way to remove the registration from a SUMo.
I replace my main PC and decided to move the registration from my old PC to my new one.
I could not find any place to unregister.
The logical place for this would be on the About screen (where the register option is available)
TagsNo tags attached.

Activities

wolf

2019-07-17 10:42

reporter   ~0003563

I don't yet understand your request. You selected project SUMo Online. In the description, you don't refer to that context. So I ask of which kind of registration (and corresponding unregistration) are you writing?

Do you mean the registration of a SUMo PC in SUMo Online and its dashboard?
Or do you mean the registration of a local SUMo installation in the corresponding Windows registry of the same PC?
Or do you mean the registration of a local SUMo installation for enabling its professional edition features with corresponding license?

As far as I understood, the undo of registration in SUMo Online and its dashboard is already implemented and could be labelled more appropriately. It is the action button delete in the dashboard which removes the registration of the selected PC off the dashboard.

Concerning the Windows registry, deinstalling SUMo should also remove its entries in the Windows registry.

Concerning the license for enabling SUMo professional edition, I've indeed not seen a kind of such unregistering action eventually wanted for transfer of these features of one PC to another. But I don't know neither how deeply this license is coupled to PC, SUMo UID or some other kind of factor. I've not seen such component data requested in the purchase process. So I guess such a coupling is loose and done on server side, not on client side and validated i.e. on SUMo startup. So if you don't use the old PC any longer, it might eventually sufficient to register the new PC. I don't know if you need to deinstall SUMo first on the old PC nor if deinstalling will reliably inform SUMo server, i.e. when the old PC has no Internet connection on time of deinstalling. So probably such a transfer may need not only registering the new PC but additionally a service call via email to KC Softwares. (That's similar to Windows license transfer where you need to make a phone call to Microsoft service although license coupling is certainly much stronger for Windows compared to SUMo as this service call is needed for Microsoft not only for transferring license of one PC to another but also if you upgrade and change more PC components more quickly then expected by Microsoft.)

johnldove

2019-07-17 14:48

reporter   ~0003567

I want to keep the unregistered version on the old PC.
I want to use the registration key on the replacement PC.
I want to continue to monitor both the old and new PC's in SUMo online.
Since I will not be uninstalling SUMo, the X (delete) button is not what I want.
In another licensed software package, there's a Deactivate License and Change License Key option under My Account.
I'm not advocating such an elaborate setup, but would it be possible to add a Deactivate License button on the Help-About popup? There's an Enter License button on the unregistered version.
Again, I am not suggesting adding an elaborate license management service -- maybe in the future?
But for those users who want to play fair and not use more licenses than they own, they could unregister the old PC when they move the license to the new PC.
Thank you!

wolf

2019-07-17 16:47

reporter   ~0003568

I don't have such a licensed software. I too have licensed software which has a "Change License Key" option but no "My Account" option. And vice-versa. I've licensed software which has a "My Account" option which has no local change license key option. And I'm not aware of having a licensed software with a "Deactivate License" option. I understand all these options. What wonders me is the combination you described of other software for a single product.

So if I understand your feature request right, it covers TWO aspects:
* My Account service and
* User-initiated downgrade of professional edition (and feature set) to basic one

Downgrade of professional edition (and feature set) to basic one is already implemented. So far it is only initiated by server side. This initiation may be intended for known usage scenarios of the past and some are discovered as happening unintended. So I agree that adding user-initiated downgrade makes sense for the scenario you described and some similar ones in your proposed location seems appropriate too.

When reading your last note, I wanted to look up license resp. copyright restrictions of SUMo in the product and couldn't find it. It is displayed on first installation. But I don't remember all details. So when adding a downgrade option, it makes sense also to add a link for copyright look up too.
And does it make sense to add a link to look up the current license key when you want to transfer it to another computer?

For a "My Account" service, I don't know the current not the available options of that reseller agreement for the shop. I've the impression that this shop provides more options as currently configured. So I can't evaluate if this shop is an appropriate place to integrate such a service for license management including renewal, prolongation or extension (to more devices or users). If not, this would probably mean a little bit more service on server side and adding a new section on KC Softwares home page for accessing it. In that case, it makes sense not only to address license management but provide access to other online services included with professional edition feature set (like SUMo Online dashboard) without reauthentication.

What I wanted to look up in copyright note was the specified limitations on acceptable like number of devices with SUMo basic edition and number of devices on SUMo Online dashboard eventually differentiated between basic edition and professional edition. I only found the limit on number of devices covered by a SUMo professional license key distinguished between one year, lifetime and premium and its user constraint. I could imagine other combinations in time and users like family options and small organizations options. I guess KC Softwares will provide corresponding solutions on request. And I further guess that the amount of constructive feed back already provided for the improvement and development of the same product may be taken into account in a quote.

I assume that the copyright does not yet specify different limits for local use compared with SUMo Online service. I don't know if there are any plans to explicitely specify such differentiated limits for the online service neither.

License management has another side too. Organizations and enterprises may need to document that they are fully licensed. While legal constraints will require such compliance management and documentation most often starting with a certain size of organization or enterprise, there are application domains for which size doesn't matter either by legal constraints or by contractual constraints i.e. as supplier for national critical infrastructure (legal constraints) or for parts of the automotive industry (contractual constraints). Is this compliance audit and documentation an option for extension of SUMo Professional edition or for a seperate product?

johnldove

2019-07-17 21:57

reporter   ~0003570

You have posed great questions. Some of them are above my paygrade. However, that hasn't stopped me from giving my opinion before. :-D

Malwarebytes is the software I'm referencing. While I can see that having the My Account functionality would be a great end-game, but my main thought was just the Unregister button on the About screen.
However, I like the thought of being able to know the serial number so I can transfer it to the new PC after I unregister it on the old PC. The only place I could find was https://www.kcsoftwares.com/?buy which shows that the lifetime license is for 4 PC's for SUMo and DUMo.
I haven't seen any restrictions for unregistered use. I think it's a great model to let users use the manual version so they can see the advantages of having the PRO version. Malwarebytes uses this model.
If you are consdering making it more limited or annoying, consider the alternative: PatchMyPC (https://patchmypc.com/home-updater-download) -- a free updater that checks and updates a large number of common programs. If you make the unregistered version more unattractive, PatchMyPC is a reasonable GoTo instead.
Great idea to have a link to the Copyright on the About dialog box.
If you show the license as part of the "Unregister" function, it would be great if you could show how may of the four PC's allowed are in use (the icing on the cake would be to show the license (last 4-6 digits) on the Desktop next to the respective PC (but I repeat myself).
As to corporate use, if you sell Site Licenses (not a clue about how much to charge -- definitely above my paygrade!), then the license checking would be a lot easier because you'd not have to count the licenses. Ooops, another complication: Would you allow home-use for employees? Would you be able to tell where the license is installed? If not, it would be posted on the Internet and used everywhere -- for free!
On a related note, please consider removing the SUMo Online option in the free version of SUMo. I think this registration should be done from a dashboard program that identifies the PC's and adds/removes then at the Server level. I prefer the client-server model where the client is divorced from the server/controller. This should eliminate support questions from the monitored PC's ("What the heck is this online stuff?") Just my 2c again.



(BTW, Looking for the copyright info, I went to the SUMo-Help-Help and Uninstall Instructions" page: https://www.kcsoftwares.com/help.htm -- it seems to be broken -- blank page -- page source:
<meta http-equiv="refresh" content="durée;URL=https://www.kcsoftwares.com/?cont"acts"> ).

As a side note, DUMo, with it's timeout before you go to the update page is really annoying and I don't use it because of that (and because I have had mixed to poor results with the free version finding drivers. Maybe the PRO version that goes directly to the mfg driver download would be better). I don't have access to the DUMo Mantis site, or I would add that as an issue. IMHO

Anyway, I may be getting too far afield -- a lot of this is stuff you guys are much better able to figure out. Just my ramblings. Thanks for your patience.

wolf

2019-07-18 00:34

reporter   ~0003573

You already have access to DUMo Mantis site. It's the same for all products of KC Softwares. You'll see it if you switch of project SUMo to All Projects (top right in Mantis, just left of your user name). And when you want to switch to DUMo, you'll select DUMo as project instead.

I have only the basic version of DUMo making similar experience. DUMo has a similar configuration as SUMo as it skips Microsoft drivers which are usually updated via Windows Update service. While Windows and other tools report about more than 420 drivers on my notebook, DUMo reports about 50 only. This DUMo default skipping policy is not documented and may not (yet) be changed via settings. And don't worry if you don't find a driver update reported by DUMo as available. It often shows that it is for another hardware revision, another operating system version or a beta driver risking to make your system more unreliable.

I think SUMo copyright and DUMo copyright are the same. I just saw the DUMo copyright. And it specifies the allowed number of computers with basic DUMo installation as ONE. So that's probably the same number for SUMo.

My note on SUMo limitations was not intended to further restrict SUMo but instead raised the question if it makes sense to clarify on the limits for SUMo Online.

For initiating computer discovery of the server side raises concerns on firewalls.

johnldove

2019-07-18 04:34

reporter   ~0003574

You already have access to DUMo Mantis site. It's the same for all products of KC Softwares. You'll see it if you switch of project SUMo to All Projects (top right in Mantis, just left of your user name). And when you want to switch to DUMo, you'll select DUMo as project instead.
**Ans: Thank you!

I have only the basic version of DUMo making similar experience. DUMo has a similar configuration as SUMo as it skips Microsoft drivers which are usually updated via Windows Update service. While Windows and other tools report about more than 420 drivers on my notebook, DUMo reports about 50 only. This DUMo default skipping policy is not documented and may not (yet) be changed via settings. And don't worry if you don't find a driver update reported by DUMo as available. It often shows that it is for another hardware revision, another operating system version or a beta driver risking to make your system more unreliable.
**Ans: I have tried several Device Driver programs -- none of them are as capable as SUMo. So it's not a surprise that DUMo has limitations.

I think SUMo copyright and DUMo copyright are the same. I just saw the DUMo copyright. And it specifies the allowed number of computers with basic DUMo installation as ONE. So that's probably the same number for SUMo.
**Ans: I copied the Copyright from the initial install screen of SUMo (it's below). It is a boilerplate EULA that needs updating in lieu of the 4-PC license on the Shop page at KCSoftwares: https://www.kcsoftwares.com/?buy
"Single product licence
 SUMo & DUMo PRO for up to 4 PCs (same user)"

There are at least two things in the EULA that need to be changed:
1. This License only refers to a paid license. It says that the buyer is only authorized to install a single copy. That should be changed from:
" a single copy of the Licensed Software on a single computer"
to:
" the number of paid, authorized copies of the Licensed Software on the number of allowed computers. etc."
2. There is no mention of the unlicensed version. When the paragraph is composed, it should specify the terms of the free use. I would recommend you keep it as it seems today. Free forever, but without the PRO capabilities.


My note on SUMo limitations was not intended to further restrict SUMo but instead raised the question if it makes sense to clarify on the limits for SUMo Online.
**Ans: I understand. I think this issue should be limited to ONLY the stand-alone SUMo, with no reference to the Online.

For initiating computer discovery of the server side raises concerns on firewalls.
**Ans: This assumes the Dashboard is hosted on the server, not on the individual PC's where SUMo is installed.)
I would be satisfied with the following process:
1. Go to (remotely or physically) the remote PC and install SUMo.
2. Copy the UID (and whatever else is needed -- see next para following) from the SUMo installation.
3. Log into the Dashboard and provide the details from the Remote PC installation. (Not sure what details would be needed, but current installations reach out to the server to sign in. So would need evaluate how to reach from the Server to the newly SUMo installed PC.)

By the way: An interim fix while you are working on a Server based Dashboard would be to:
Require both the usernane AND the password to connect this PC to the SUMo Online Configuration -- Dashboard. Right now, only the username is required, so anyone can attach their SUMo to the Dashboard -- just have the username.



KC Softwares - SUMO SOFTWARE LICENSE

1. LICENSE. In consideration of your payment of applicable license fees, KC Softwares ("Kc Softwares") hereby grants to you, the undersigned, and you accept, a nonexclusive, nontransferable license to install, use, and display a single copy of the Licensed Software on a single computer. You may move the Licensed Software from one computer to another, but may not have the Licensed Software resident on more than one computer unless you have paid a license for each additional computer. You may use the Licensed Software for the purpose of developing your own software applications, in accordance with the terms of Paragraph 2, below. A copy of the Licensed Software may be made for archival or backup purposes as long as it contains all the original Licensed Software proprietary notices. You may not sublicense, rent, distribute, lease or otherwise transfer or assign any or all of your rights in the Licensed Software. You may use the Licensed Software solely in its original form, and may not change, alter or modify the Licensed Software, translate, reverse assemble, reverse compile, disassemble, or in any way reverse engineer the Licensed Software. This license does not grant you any right to bug, fixes, enhancements, updates or new versions, but if such are made available to and are obtained by you, then they shall become part of the Licensed Software and governed by the terms of this License. KC Softwares reserves all rights not expressly granted to you in this License.

Kyle_Katarn

2019-07-19 22:54

administrator   ~0003576

Do you mean revert from SUMo PRO to SUMo Free ? Or remove a PC from SUMo online ?

wolf

2019-07-19 23:08

reporter   ~0003579

John already replied in his first note https://www.kcsoftwares.com/bugs/view.php?id=5580#c3567 .
In the view of the old PC, he wants to revert from SUMo Pro to SUMo Free.
In the view of his usage and of KC Softwares, he wants to free and transfer one SUMo PRO license INSTANCE to his new PC in order to remain complying to license restrictions.
He definitely doesn't want to remove a PC from SUMo Online.

Kyle_Katarn

2019-07-20 10:58

administrator   ~0003581

OK, then it's a SUMo client evolution request (I move this issue to the relevant section)

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
2019-07-17 00:13 johnldove New Issue
2019-07-17 10:42 wolf Note Added: 0003563
2019-07-17 14:48 johnldove Note Added: 0003567
2019-07-17 16:47 wolf Note Added: 0003568
2019-07-17 21:57 johnldove Note Added: 0003570
2019-07-18 00:34 wolf Note Added: 0003573
2019-07-18 04:34 johnldove Note Added: 0003574
2019-07-19 22:54 Kyle_Katarn Assigned To => Kyle_Katarn
2019-07-19 22:54 Kyle_Katarn Status new => feedback
2019-07-19 22:54 Kyle_Katarn Note Added: 0003576
2019-07-19 23:08 wolf Note Added: 0003579
2019-07-20 10:58 Kyle_Katarn Note Added: 0003581
2019-07-20 10:59 Kyle_Katarn Project SUMo Online => SUMo
2019-07-20 10:59 Kyle_Katarn Status feedback => acknowledged
2019-07-20 10:59 Kyle_Katarn Target Version => 5.10.x